Calimoto GPX Route that works for Garmin XT

[jfheath]

I loved the simplicity of the 660. And as you said, it behaved like a route made entirely of Shaping Points on the later models with the trip planner app. Join the route anywhere, it would navigate ahead.

They seemed to have a lot of complaints from people having difficulty with figure-of-eight routes where a short section of road was ridden twice - that it would keep missing half of the route ! Presumably the people complaining never thought to work out why.

I did discover different behaviours on the 660 when navigating according to how the point had been created on Mapsource, and made some notes about my observations, but I got tempted by a cheap offer of a 590 if I traded in the 660. I often wish that I hadn't.

The waypoint / via point confusion is understandable when you read some of Garmin's help pages with headings like 'How to change a waypoint into a shaping point' - link. In the three links above, I found it hard to find pages like this which I thought would add to the confusion.

There is a weird behaviour on the XT that I am still trying to fathom out. I can't remember now if it was @Fxwheels (you) or @Peobody that mentioned something about it. I have only just got round to experimenting.
Create a route using the XT screen Start, Finish and Shaping Point in the middle. Long enough to give the satnav some choices. Then change the shaping point to a Via point. The entire route changes.

Its difficult to then change the Via point back to a shaping point because the XT moves its location.

I need to test this out with routes produced in Basecamp.

[Omobono]

Update here:

1) yesterday I spent some hours, until late in the night, trying to get to grips with Basecamp. The youtube videos of EZ Moto Tim were quite a revelation and, whilst I have not seen all of them, I can say that now I can use the software and it is, as expected, vastly superior to everything else out there if you have a Garmin satnav. However, it will remain less immediate to use as it is very detailed and precise.

2) I have also reuploaded the MyRoute trip from the satnav to Basecamp on my PC. All the named points were there as "do not alert on arrival". I have modified all of them and they now looks exactly as if a "flag" should appear when I reach every one of them (I will check when I am out on the bike again). Therefore, a "faster" alternative could be to create the trip on MyRoute on the PC, then import the .gpx file on Basecamp and simply take care that you are alerted whenever you want to be alerted. However, I think I will soon become enough apt with Basecamp that I will not feel the need to save time with MyRoute.

Basecamp is a completely non-intuitive exercise for people accustomed to Google Maps and the like. It also is very complex in that you need to care that your satnav is connected, you are using the proper map set etc. However, once you get in the mind of the "mad scientists" who created it, it starts to make sense and proves a very flexible instrument, particularly if you are not only a biker, but also a hiker etc.

[FrankB]

I have added a Howto describing how to get a route in Google Maps and check for road blocks.
viewtopic.php?t=1965

[Fxwheels]

There is a weird behaviour on the XT that I am still trying to fathom out. I can't remember now if it was @Fxwheels (you) or @Peobody that mentioned something about it. I have only just got round to experimenting.
Create a route using the XT screen Start, Finish and Shaping Point in the middle. Long enough to give the satnav some choices. Then change the shaping point to a Via point. The entire route changes.

Its difficult to then change the Via point back to a shaping point because the XT moves its location.

I need to test this out with routes produced in Basecamp.

In my experience, changing Shaping to Via won't change the route. Maybe it depends on the lengths between the via points. I'll check again and let you know.

[Fxwheels]

Update here:

1) yesterday I spent some hours, until late in the night, trying to get to grips with Basecamp. The youtube videos of EZ Moto Tim were quite a revelation and, whilst I have not seen all of them, I can say that now I can use the software and it is, as expected, vastly superior to everything else out there if you have a Garmin satnav. However, it will remain less immediate to use as it is very detailed and precise.

2) I have also reuploaded the MyRoute trip from the satnav to Basecamp on my PC. All the named points were there as "do not alert on arrival". I have modified all of them and they now looks exactly as if a "flag" should appear when I reach every one of them (I will check when I am out on the bike again). Therefore, a "faster" alternative could be to create the trip on MyRoute on the PC, then import the .gpx file on Basecamp and simply take care that you are alerted whenever you want to be alerted. However, I think I will soon become enough apt with Basecamp that I will not feel the need to save time with MyRoute.

Basecamp is a completely non-intuitive exercise for people accustomed to Google Maps and the like. It also is very complex in that you need to care that your satnav is connected, you are using the proper map set etc. However, once you get in the mind of the "mad scientists" who created it, it starts to make sense and proves a very flexible instrument, particularly if you are not only a biker, but also a hiker etc.

I'm glad you got the grip on Basecamp. In short you won't need to use any other software to plan a route. Also, people here can always help if you have any Basecamp questions.
Another Basecamp advantage - no need the internet to use - your gps using satellites.

[FrankB]

@jfheath @Fxwheels I'm pretty sure that the 'moving point' can occur when you change it on the XT from Via to Shaping. It happened to me one time and since i've never did that again to prevent the problem.

@Omobono Watch out when you import routes from Myroute.App in Basecamp. Because of different maps, and possibly other reasons, you will find many Via and Shaping points in Basecamp not ON the road, but OFF the road. Causing all kind of problems, especially when starting routes from 'Closest Entry Point'. I have posted a, not very well received article, how to correct these points using Javawa RtwTool. viewtopic.php?t=1868

[Fxwheels]

@jfheath @Fxwheels I'm pretty sure that the 'moving point' can occur when you change it on the XT from Via to Shaping. It happened to me one time and since i've never did that again to prevent the problem.

@Omobono Watch out when you import routes from Myroute.App in Basecamp. Because of different maps, and possibly other reasons, you will find many Via and Shaping points in Basecamp not ON the road, but OFF the road. Causing all kind of problems, especially when starting routes from 'Closest Entry Point'. I have posted a, not very well received article, how to correct these points using Javawa RtwTool. viewtopic.php?t=1868

That's right - if converting Shaping into Via (in the unit), it won't be repositioned. Problem is when converting Via to Shaping.

As for the via/shaping not being on the road - yes it can happen in any route creating program. If the road is far on the map, it's easy to miss it. Normally it is misplaced not very far from the road and you can see and ignore this shaping point while riding. Problem can arise in case of misplaced Via point because the nav will annoy you to visit it. A simple way to check is to open the route selection (left pan), find the via point (alert on arrival) and zoom it in.
Beware of placing a shaping point at the opposite side of the highway (motorway...). In the unfamiliar to you territory it will make you do unnecessary exit and a u-turn. Yes, it can be a tedious process to check 30 points, so try your best to putting them right as you plan the route especially on the major roads.

[Omobono]

Thanks FrankB.

Just for fun, because I intend to use Basecamp more and more, I have made a short trip on MyRouteApp, paying attention that I zoom very near and put my markers exactly on the road. I'll try to test it during the long weekend ahead. If MyRouteApp puts the flags exactly where they should be I think it will remain a valid alternative to Basecamp because faster in the execution particularly is one has to create a big route (but I will still have to upload the file on Basecamp in order to modify the points to "alert on arrival"). If not, it will be Basecamp or death...

I will report after the long weekend (we have an extra day of holiday on Monday because of the Queen's funeral).

[FrankB]

Good luck.
As a side note: I was thinking you live in Italy, judging by the flag of your account???

[jfheath]

Thanks FrankB.

Just for fun, because I intend to use Basecamp more and more, I have made a short trip on MyRouteApp, paying attention that I zoom very near and put my markers exactly on the road. I'll try to test it during the long weekend ahead. If MyRouteApp puts the flags exactly where they should be I think it will remain a valid alternative to Basecamp because faster in the execution particularly is one has to create a big route (but I will still have to upload the file on Basecamp in order to modify the points to "alert on arrival"). If not, it will be Basecamp or death...

I will report after the long weekend (we have an extra day of holiday on Monday because of the Queen's funeral).

Hi @Omobono

You do not have to go into BAsecamp to identify route points as alert on arrival, or don't alert on arrival. MyRouteApp will do that as well.
They have hidden the facility away on the extended menu. By default the points are the tear drop icons - these are non-alerting route points. Garmin calls these Shaping Points. If you get the expanded menu, there is a hand raised in a 'STOP' gesture. This indicates that these are stopping points - the ones that in the Garmins will alert on arrival. Garmin calls them Via Points.

MRA has also started to use the term Via Points and Shaping Points - at least when you hover the mouse over the appropriate icon inthe toolbox.

Here is the MRA screen - with some modifications from me. Note that I have the OSM maps selected. For full comaptibility with Garmin's maps, HERE maps should be used.

MRA Symbols.png (596.52 KiB) Viewed 883 times

Here's one of my routes in MRA. Points 1, 4, and 6 are all hands = Via Points = Alert on Arrival.
Points 2, 3 and 5 are all tear drops = Shaping Points = Do not alert on arrival.

Click the image for a much larger version.

By default when you clcik on a route point, you see the menu surrounded by a white box with 6 icons in it. The three dot icon opens up an extended menu which replaces the one in the white box. I have Paintshopped the extended menu onto the image and surrounded it with a grey box. There is now a hand icon which you can click to make the tear drop shaping point into a hand Via Point. If you click on a hand point in your route, the icon changes to a tear drop. So you can use MRA to easily switch between Via and Shaping points.

There are a couple of other issues which may concern you.

MRA uses the term 'Waypoint' to refer to any point that you plcae on the route. This is quite common with many applications and many people that you care to talk to. Garmin use the term differently. For Garmin, a Waypoint is a point that is created and saved for future use to make route creation easier. Garmin's Waypoints can also contain additional information about the location - eg address, post code, phone number, ....
When transferred to the Zumo, Waypoints will be placed automatically inside the 'Favourites' section of the stanav (UK language), or in 'Saved' if the stanav is set to USA and some other countries.

MRA also has a Favourites - which stores locations for future use. But - as far as I have been able to determine - MRA Favourites cannot be made to appear in Zumo's Favourites / Saved areas. However, points selected from MRA's. POI library will be transferred to the XT and will be treated like Garmin's waypoints, showing up in Favourites.

The second thing is what happens when you create the GPX file in MRA. There are a number of options - only two of which I am going to discuss here.


GPX v1.2 (Route, Track, POI).

This is the format that MRA recommend for use with the later Garmins. But these are to be treated with a word of caution. What you get is a route which (if you have the Gold MRA HERE maps) will follow the Zumo roads precisely. Just like Basecamp routes. But you do not get any shaping points with this v1.2 format. The route will pass through all of the places where you plotted a shaping point, but the Zumo does not know where they are. It only knows where the road was plotted. It does however have all of the Via Point information. This means that if the rout is recalculated, the Zumo only has the Via Points to work with, and your route will then look very different from the one that you originally plotted.

This MAY be OK if you have automatic recalculation turned off. But many members on here will report on the route being recalculated regardless of this setting - this is an XT thing, not a MRA issue. I don't know of anyone that has pinned down precisely when the recalculation takes place and the XT does not tell you when it is recalculating ! It is possibly due to traffic information coming in throught the 'aerial' (the power lead). But I do not know.
Whatever - with this type of route, just as with a BAsecamp route, the XT does not have to calculate the route when it is first loaded.

GPX v1.1 (Route, Track, POI).

This format will also work with the Zumos. The information that is passed to the Zumo is just the route points - start, finish, all of the Vias, all of the Shaping points. It doesn't send any information about the vehicle - so the Zumos default to using the motorcycle. None of the avoidances that you may have set in MRA are passed (which is exaclty the same with Basecamp routes). The XT is left to calculate the route from the route points that have been plotted and the preferences that you have set for the motorcycle in your Zumo.

Which sounds a bit scary - but it isn't. If ever the Zumo recalculates a route the XT will use exactly the same information and ignore the Magenta line that it had when it first started the route. At least v1.1 has all of the via and shaping points intact so the new route will go through all of the key points. The XT tends to head for faster roads, if it is given the chance. If you place the shaping points to prevent that from happening then your route will likely look very similar to the MRA route.

I nay case, for both version, you have the track exactly as MRA created it, and the XT can be set up to display the route AND the track on the same screen. This make it easy to spot whent he route has been altered and gives the option of folowing the recalculated route (magenta line) or the original route (shown by the track).

Track is just line that is plotted on the map in whatever colour that you want, which will be drawn on the XT screen exactly as it appeared on the MRA map. (Basecamp has this facility too). On current models of Zumo (XT and 396) but also on the 595, you can convert a track to a 'Trip' and the Zumo will follow the magenta line giving turn by turn directions. There are no route points on such a trip, but it will never be recalculated.

POI is point of interest - which sounds like the same sort of thing as Garmin's Waypoints. (Garmin can also use POIs, but they seem to be slightly different. The last time that I checked, MRA were still working on POIs).

You can send stuff from MRA to the XT without a cable connection. One way is to email it to your mobile phone if using a PC. If using the MRA App on your phone, you just have to send it to the Drive App. In either case, once Drive has received it, it sends the route by Bluetooth to your XT. The route does not go through the transfer and import process - it gets loaded straight into trip planner. That means that the route is not available to import again, should you mess it up or accidentally delete it from Trip Planner. But - if you sent it by email, keep the email to send it to Drive again.

What is nice about MRA's routes, is that the XT does not (often) change the names that you have given each of the route points.

If you want to know why that is - well I can bore you at a later date !!

Enough. I've said far too much.