Master Volume and Bluetooth glitches - Please share yours too!

[Orre]

Hi guys!

Jan Orre calling from Norway!

I have issues with BT and Master Volume Slider erratic behaviour.
I have read all posts i could find regarding this but I cannot find any answers.
I find it to be bugs/glitches in the system, but I don't know where to report those bugs? -Or how to install a working main system?...
Please redirect if answered before!

Edit: -There's no real question below... All my long text is just a description of the bugs and glitches I experience, to see if this are common faults? And maybe to collect users, and hopefully even help someone, that need to address the same. -I have seen several posts regarding the stupid disappearing "main volume slider"...
-The question is as stated initially: HOW TO GET A BUG-FREE UPDATE?
A 3 year old Garmin shouldn't have glitches from the nineties!!

As most people, I do sometimes listen to music/audiobook/podcast etc.
The audio part has always been a major reason to have a Garmin screen in front of me! (I'm not always lost) And I was really disappointed to find that this new fancy XT doesn't seem to have improved much compared to my old 660...
-Thing is. Sooner or later I ALWAYS find myself in a situation where the sound is disturbing, and I RAPIDLY want to lower, or mute, the volume! My simple little wish, is that this should be fast and easily reachable!

First problem arising, is of course when the master volume has magically disappeared, and I have to go one step further trying to find the right slider in the menu... -Another couple of life threatening seconds gone...
After fiddling around and reading about this, I found this happens by design when you are connecting (some) headphones!?
So what's the idea with this?? I cannot see how anyone could benefit from loosing the option too choose?? -We often DO wear gloves don't we! True wireless earbuds where it is impossible to reach any buttons seem to be the most common today! And from my POV this is nevertheless a MAJOR reason to have this Garmin device in front of me!!...

After finding out that connecting "head-phones" vs media only was the culprit, removing that tic, and just keep "media", the master volume slider does (sometimes) comes back! -But it is not working!?...
(Does anyone use BT communication units that does NOT include the capability to make phone calls???....)

-I did get this to work for a little while though, (after resetting the XT) and I think it was due to the headset at the time was capable of "Multipoint Bluetooth", but after returning that otherwise expensive and crappy headset, neither the new earbuds I bought or any of my older headsets have this feature, and I haven't found any other way around this?

Even if I untick BT phone capability both at my phone and at the Garmin the issue persist. -Erratic though... Sometimes the slider show up, sometimes not.
The XT even connect to BT headsets as a "headphone" even if the phone is removed and not present!?
And in any case, if I untick this box, the XT just ignores my setting the next time the headset is connected!...

The master volume is quite consistent in not working at all when any BT headset connected though...
-Almost! Because I found I can add 3 menu-shortcuts directly to the map screen, where one option is a "mute" button! Yey!... What a brilliant way to kill all sounds in a "situation"! I thought....
Well. Short was that joy, Because that shortcut turned out to only "mute" and not "un-mute"?? (Then you still have to open the menu to "un-mute" the original button.)
-If that should happen to work... Because that is surely neither for sure!. Sometimes when the mute button has actually worked, I cannot get the sound back without restarting the XT, or at least restart BT, or restart the headset or..........

And all this is just if I happen to be so lucky to even reach the volume menu, because if I have the map screen up front (without directions set), There is neither any shortcut to the player or the volume settings, and extra steps, and extra time with concentration away from traffic arises!...

"Design features" I understand I cannot complain much about, but I can see you guys report about loads of glitches and bugs when it comes to navigating and routing. -I haven't done much of that with this device so far, but I find those small glitches mentioned bad enough to take it further!
-I mean. Every single fraction of a second I have my concentration elsewhere then on the road, is potentially life threatening seconds!...
And Garmin is a company with HUGE experience of navigation devices! -How can such a buggy software even hit the shelves??
-And how come these ridiculous glitches isn't addressed on a device that was released over 3 YEARS ago???

Is it just me?

---

Sorry for the long letter.
And to add to it, I couldn't resist sharing my last weeks earbud chase and experiences. -It is kind of kind of within the topic isn't it...

Because as today's market seem to mostly address people that want "True Wireless ANC earbuds" to work on the bus, plane, car or train, I have really searched high and low again for a nice PASSIVE noise cancelling headset! (My last of several sets with the plain and amazing "JVC HA-FX39BT" is sadly more or less worn out, and now also outdated...)
-I use passively noise reducing earbuds/earplugs in many situations. And also riding motorbike I simply prefer earbuds over helmet speakers. But as I want as much noise cancelling as possible, I certainly find it interesting if there COULD be any ANC device that can deal with helmet wind noise (and a 1800cc. V-twin) (I have tried MANY over the years!) So once again I purchased the best I could find where I live. This time it was the "Isotunes Pro Aware"

But be aware! as I now have experienced "Isotunes" to just be some hyped up expensive rubbish! (I couldn't even find ANY even slightly negative reviews!? before I physically returned it in the shop. Then all the guys in the shop told me they NEVER recommend anything from this company!... -Google runs the show...)
Anyway. For the "Isotunes Pro Aware" I bought, the cord is so short the battery-packs hang like earrings, the sound is cheap and weak, the volume is so low you can barely hear them, and voices is out of the question, the ANC does a lousy job, and even just amplify all noise, the mic as bad, and I promise any 10 buck earbuds with foam tip will kill ambient noise at least as good, and most often better then this crap!!! -The only positive thing I can say, is that routing the cord around the ear really works! -They do not fall out!
So now you don't have to even try them! -At least not with your motorbike!...

On the other hand, even if I didn't think I would want any, the guys in the shop sold me a True Wireless set, called "NERO-TX" from a company called "SOUND by SWEDEN".
WOW! What a sound!! -I've been using earbuds daily both at noisy work situations and for motorcycle riding for the last 20 years, and I can honestly say I have never heard the like at this price range! Bloody high volume! But most of all, real deep and rich bass! Really impressing!
I got them yesterday, and it's still raining, so I have only "dry-tested" them, but they do certainly cancel noise as good as any noise protecting earplugs, and I haven't been able to get them to fall out, how much I have rattled around with my helmets! They are very small, and I cannot imagine them to be in conflict with any helmet, so I am quite positive to how they will behave when driving!
They also come in a ANC version, but I didn't go for that.
Edit: I am certainly not an audiophile, but I'm super happy with the "Nero TX"! Never heard any earbuds with such a massive low end profile! And never ever had any earphones playing so loud! And without distortion! -This is the first time I've been able to listen to, and really enjoy! quiet music with subtle instruments while riding a bike!! -Be careful!...
Also. I never thought I would like those tiny small "true wireless" earbuds. But it is really a whole new level of freedom to get out of the hassle with cords and battery packs! (That is IF your in hand player properly function to handle the volume and other controls!.......)
Thumbsup!
Ps. The passive noise cancellation could IMHO have been even better. I would compare it to ordinary NRR~27 rated earplugs/muffs, and in that regard the monitors below are really interesting! -But they have looong cords!...

Just to mention, I have also been been looking at noise protecting "in ear monitors" that musicians buy, also with the same "cord around ear" style. I've seen lots of recommendations for "Shure se215", and for the lookalike but much cheaper "Mee audio M6 Pro". But I would really want to avoid all that extra cords that comes with jack plug sets. (There are BT adapter for those kind of monitors, but they seem to suffer from the same "too short cord" problem as the Isotunes)

Ok. No I don't feel I only did all this testing just for my self...
Hope someone can benefit!

Peace and Love!
/Orre

[jfheath]

Wow. Hello and Welcome.

I was just about to sign off for the evening, and thought - I'll just see if anyone has posted anything new !!

I need time to digest this. I've not read it propelry, but it is commong for Bluetooth devices to relinquish control to the source of the music for the main volume. And the XT seems to do this. Which is a pain, because I cannot get to the volume on my headset.

But you do have control of the other sliders. So finding out the best settings for these given the volume you are getting out is key.

I need to go. I need to read your text properly, 'cos I don't even know if that answers the question. But at least you post is approved, and it has a response, which often alerts other people to chime in !

[Orre]

Thanks mate!

Yeah... I know... Sorry! Had to get it out! :-p

And yes, I now how to use the darn thing. I am just a bit despaired about this new shiny device having such stupid "win3.o glitches"...
Cannot remember the zumo 660 ever behaved like this...

Thanks.
/Orre

[Orre]

@jfheath Sorry I misread you. -Was too late for me too...

-You probably meant the reverse, as the source here is either the Garmin, or some another BT device with source rights.

The headset on the other hand is the "slave" here, and it MIGHT been given rights to control the source.
You do commonly have the option to control them separately, or letting the "slave" control the main source.
However. The control of this, and any other options, should lay at the source! -Just as you said.
This Garmin "design" I find totally backwards!

-And I do certainly NOT know everything about this thing! Sorry!
I am a new user, and might of course be struggling with old habits... I just think I have found out how to operate the most basics. -Like the mixer...
But I don't know what you mean with "best settings" though?

At least I need to adjust volume settings all the time! in relation to type of sound, type of song, recorded volume, speed, weather, helmet, wind etc. etc...
In my book, that is what master volume is for! -To fast and easy being able to control the whole lot! -And not the least the option to rapidly mute!

I have stopped trying to get the buggy master volume slider to work, and rather just let it be as is. Then the "mute" button at the map screen do actually work quite often! (And as I haven't used the XT a lot, these bugs will hopefully turn out to be more seldom...)
However. If I after muting, as for example stopping for gas, to talk with someone, or any other pause, where I might even take the opportunity to use some tool... Then I cannot get the sound back, without navigating back to the map-screen, hitting menu, and then the "original" mute button! (The shortcut button on the map is a most strange one-way-button!?...)
I understand I have to learn to do these things in the order this poor design force me too, like I have done in all the years with my other OLD Garmin devices... E.g. remember to fix this before I hit the road again. Because all this pushing small buttons, (that you cannot feel but has to LOOK for) is just too bloody dangerous while driving a motorcycle!!...
And it was certainly not what I expected from a brand new Garmin Zumo!!

For example. Why the heck couldn't they just let the top icon bar (with a mute) ride along with the different screens? (And why the heck do they let a twice as fat top-bar, with the text "Ready to navigate" with no what so ever function hide my screen? ...)

I know this is a navigator, but it is ALSO a source of different other tools, including a LARGELY used media player!
I haven't used it much for navigating so far, and I do not know of the bugs and glitches in that matter. But I can see they are not absent... And I find it outrageous that simple things like this isn't better designed!

I have also found when using the media player, that after stopping and disconnecting the Garmin, or headsets, the player wont resume, but it looks like it is playing. (The pause button shows) -Then pushing to next or previous song might work, or I might have to restart the player...

(Ar these bugs meant to be coming more and more as more I use this device???)

Btw. Do you guys experience this as a slow computer? -For me, pushing next song happens quite immediately! But the text to witch song doesn't come up until 4-5 seconds later!? (And if the song starts gently, it thereby might take ages to navigate to the song i want to hear!)

I know this are all trifles. But again, I cannot afford the need to over and over again look for solutions on a screen while I'm driving a motorcycle!!

-The most strangest thing is still that simple BUGS are not addressed!?
Or are there a better OS somewhere?
Or at least somewhere to report this?

And if you in all my rumbling can see that I am simply wrong, and maybe just looking at things from the wrong perspective. Pleeease let me know!!
For example, I haven't found any "sweep-commands" as we are used to from our smartphones/pads?...
-And are my experiences above really facts for all of you? Or do I have a malfunction device??

/Orre

Ps. Today I had a MARVELLOUS time riding with my new headset "NERO-TX" from "SOUND by SWEDEN"!
WOW!! -Just WOW!! Plenty volume on ½ setting! loads of bass! and I think the first time ever I have actually been able to listen to the tiniest solo in the most quiet soft song while riding!!
I am heavily impressed!

[Peobody]

I have only used the media player on the XT enough to test it but I have experienced most of what you have mentioned. I can't fully relate though because I use an in-helmet headset (Cardo Packtalk) on which I can control volume.

Your are correct about the absurdity of the on-map Mute button not being a mute/unmute toggle. Especially considering that there is one behind the 3-dot button, top right. Why Garmin didn't give the on-map button that functionality is inexplicable.

As for music selection, I do not see any song text delay when I tap the previous or next button. I don't use them though, opting instead to Browse. No display delay there either. I do that only when stopped though. When riding, if I feel I MUST have music I just turn it on a let play whatever comes up. That is rare though (only when the boredom of an Interstate slab starts getting to me). Most of the time I find music distracting. FWIW, I have 226 songs on my XT.

As for sweep-commands, the closest I can think of is the vertical touch scrolling of configuration screens.

[Orre]

@Peobody Thank you for confirming!

Yes I have also used the controls of e.g. Cardo and all my other headphones buttons for all past years. Partly because of using my phone for music.
That's why I found it really disappointing when this new shiny Zumo XT doesn't seem to be much of an upgrade since the 14 yo. Zumo 660! At least not the user interface! And definitely wasn't expecting to find heaps of bugs first thing! -This I find it embarrassing to say the least!

Thank you for the input about song-text-delay! This made me go experimenting with SD cards, and I have used many hours with a few different 8-32GB. SDHC cards, and one 64GB. SDXC. I tested by adding more and more songs to a single folder on a 32GB SDHC card. And after playing a while, the more songs seemed to equal slower output.
-The SDXC card, Garmin couldn't read at all!? -Even when the Zumo itself formatted it as FAT32!?... I just couldn't bother to persecute this too at the moment. But the XT is advertised to handle 256GB??...
-For the SDHC cards, I firstly didn't find any difference with producer or card-size, or how many songs I put there... -Still slow on text output. And couldn't read folder structures...

But I did found a thread where @danham advertised how bad formatting could to be a culprit, and I also tried the recommended "SD Card Formatter".
-This did fix the slow text output! -for a while.... Because after playing and skipping a bunch of songs, it just became slower and slower again... And I gave up when it took 10 seconds from skip song to change text!...

Browsing didn't work at all with any SD card. The Garmin only showed a couple search letters, and which letter changed all the time...

Putting songs on the internal memory worked a little faster, and the browser also did seem to work! But when I filled up the memory, it was getting nearly as slow...
I haven't found any other difference compared to SD card storage.

But I also found it to be extremely sensitive to file-structures and file-names! Special characters like our Scandinavian åæøäö didn't work at all. And even more sensitive it seemed to be for Mp3-tags!
All files had to be directly under the main "Mp3" folder! And I have really struggled and renamed heaps of files and tags, trying to find out what the heck triggers Garmin to NOT recognize files??...

But stranger things happens! And with adding and removing files to the internal memory, it suddenly started to act positive to multiple folders! And with more folder and less files per folder, it also reacted quicker! And after MANY hours wrestling with this stupid old OS, It suddenly started to read subfolders too! Yeay!

Of course I cannot say this will last... But the last thing I have done now, is copying part of my original Mp3 collection folder structure, with mainly "Artist/Album/Track and maybe also Covers". And I have completely filled up a 32GB card with thousands of files! -And now it works!?...
-Now I have both .mp3's and .jpg-covers several subfolders deep! And also .m3u-playlists laying around where ever!
And even browsing seem to work!
(Schhh! -I still do not dare to speak out load about this though...)

In the process I have also edited filenames and folder-structures, and also made playlists for a bunch of audiobooks, and these also seem to work at the moment! Regardless of how many layers under the Mp3 header they lay!
-I also found that the audiobooks seem to be nicely separated in the "Genre" menu. So it should possibly not be necessary to add playlists to those!?...
However, there are no "All songs" menu, and to be able to have music on random play without having audiobooks in the mix, I did make a "All Songs" .m3u-playlist with all music and put that on top.
(I have btw. been making playlists with a small program called "Mp3tag".)

Now with all songs stored in lots of different folders, it all seem to work with no more then a little second delay.
So far so good!

And regarding the old layout and stubid bugs, It seems I just have to realise that this Zumo XT wasn't much of an upgrade, and just treat it as I have done with the 660 the last 14 years...
Hopefully I will find use for some of the other tools! And hopefully it will be able to guide me! Maybe even a bit more "adventurous"?...

I am a bit puzzled with the so far over 160 thread-views though?... I know many struggle with lots of text. But it seems the header is attracting! And it would be really nice to know if my device might be faulty? Or all this is just as you all experience?...

Thanks.
/Orre

[Peobody]

I am a bit puzzled with the so far over 160 thread-views though?... I know many struggle with lots of text. But it seems the header is attracting! And it would be really nice to know if my device might be faulty? Or all this is just as you all experience?...

Don't pay much attention to the thread view count. I have only posted twice but have visited this thread probably 10 times.

I don't have the impression that you have a faulty device. You have high expectations, which is as it should be. Unfortunately, they disappointment as you figure out the capabilities and shortcomings of the XT. I feel fortunate that my first GPS was the XT. I did not have any expectations. My only prior experience with a GPS was entering a destination address into the car GPS. I found myself in awe of the XT's capabilities yet really frustrated and aggravated by Garmin's implimentation in many areas.

[Orre]

@Peobody Thanks mate!

Yes I have read enough despaired post to know I'm not alone!....
And as I have used the same Zumo 660 for 14 years, I also find this Zumo XT with it's 15 y.o OS and 25 y.o. USB-b connection is a Garmin DECEPTION!
Except for a better screen and added fancy apps. I cannot see any difference at all!?... -I mean, it even use the 20 y.o. "Basecamp" that I have hardly ever seen ANYONE finding to be a usable tool!!??...

Don't get me wrong. It's a highly usable tool! But the interface and user friendliness seem to got stuck two decades ago, and just doesn't follow what we are used to see otherwise today.

And I'll say it again: What I find even worse, is that this 15 y.o. OS seem to be FULL of bugs and glitches, that are not addressed!!????
How the f_ck can one of the largest producers in the world get away with this??

14 years ago I did spend days and weeks getting my new expensive Zumo 660 to work the way I wanted, and at the time it was just as expected... The tool was awesome! -Just as @Peobody probably feel today.
But the need to "fool" a device into doing it's tasks is kind of outdated!
And to experience a lot of small bugs and glitches as described, just isn't good enough today! -Everyone knows that!
The only one that can get away with such a fraud, is the one without competition!
THIS is what I find intolerable!

And this is why I had hopes that someone had found, or made, a working OS for this bloody thing!
(Considering how it handles, it probably hasn't the processor power though....)

Being as disappointed and disillusioned as one can be, I do of course look for other solutions.
But it seems that except for a minor processor power add, finally switching out the old Basecamp software, and thereby gaining a better "on the fly" routing ability, the €300 EXTRA!! "Zumo XT2" is the exact same device!? -Could someone please confirm this?
-Any other MC-dedicated GPS navigator I haven't found?
(But of course, any cheap smartphone I have seen can do all those tasks, and a hundred more, at least as good!.... (Just no waterproof cradles, and with those BLOODY small buttons...)

--

I did another test with the 64GB SDXC card today. First did a looooong exFat format with Windows. (I have no idea if this makes any difference!) Then I put the card in the Zumo, and also this time it immediately wanted to format to FAT32. (???-OLD OS?)
Then once again I transferred a bunch of songs directly via a USB-mini cable to the XT. This time in their original folder structure, where each artist, album, song, and cover, are placed in its separate 3-4 deep folder structures. -And bugging along with the Zumo, today it did work! Yey!

So I pushed it further, and copied my entire Mp3 collection (about 47GB./6300songs/8500 files total), and made a .m3u list from that.
Plus filled up the card with audiobooks. This time NOT adding playlists to them.
The Zumo seem to separate audiobooks just fine in the Genre menu! -as long as the files are properly tagged... -As some book was missing, and I couldn't make out book-serie-order from name, I found it to still be necessary to construct .m3u playlists for each book though...
(Btw. Disappearing SD-card and closing computer-windows for no particular reason while copying, seem to be standard Garmin behaviour...)

Now the XT seemed to read file and folder structure as intended! -Seemed to...
However. Although it uses loooong time to load the lists. It turned out to only be able to read the limited number of 5000 songs.... (This stuff is so bloody embarrassing!)
-I found it to be confirmed in this thread.-
And that is if you klick the "All songs" options...
As I do not want audiobooks in my music-mix, I want to choose my music playlists instead! And now it limits the number of songs to 2556!?...
And when I split up songs with multiple .m3u playlists, it limits the TOTAL song number to 2556!!?? -How it choose what songs to exclude I haven't the faintest idea?... The numbers seem to be totally random?...

What a bloody joke of a computing device!! -Time to leave it for now!

/Orre