Weird Routing Behaviour (2)

[Stu]

So after a going through videos and and information I have documented a way that withou having to hack the reoutes, trips files a simple method works for me.

The hacking of trip files has nothing to do with the zumo going off route

Its more about when you go off route for any reason that the zumo doesn't recalculate properly and can send you round in circles trying to get you back even when the way you are going could be closer/quicker to the route

[jfheath]

Just to put you in the picture @Min

This link describes the RUT problem that the main topic of this thread.

https://www.zumouserforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=1582

The track and route solution that you describe is an excellent way of staying on the intended roads. But it doesn't fix anything, even though it is a sensible precaution and a technique that I have been using ever since it became available with the introduction of the 590s

Another technique is to disable automatic recalculation. The route never alters and when you wander away from it, the satnav stays silent. It resumes audible navigation when you rejoin the magenta line. The problem is that I don't trust it not to recalculate, so I still use the track display under the route.

[Plainmad]

So I tried a route today after having fixed it using the Java program and was happy to see that when I went off route a couple of time it just got on with adjusting the route keeping in all the via points and waypoints. So very happy with that.

I did however notice one slight issue. When I went to use the skip waypoint option on the navigation screen it said the next waypoint to skip was one I’d already been through a good hour ago. Intrigued I went into the trip planner and open the active trip (so the fixed trip which I was midway round) and noticed that all the upcoming waypoints and via points were all over the place. In that I mean that the ones it was showing next were ones I’d already been through today and one of the future via points was showing as a waypoint but the future waypoint was showing as a via point.
A look on the map option from the trip planner and all was as it was meant to be and the route ran fine. I think this might have been here before the fixed route trick but just thought it might help. Something is still not right with the XT’s

[jfheath]

Thanks for that observation @Plainmad .

Yes. I have seen that behaviour a couple of times. Under certain circumstances, the 'Skip List' is not updated when you pass through the route points, and it shows all of the points that you have already passed through.

When testing the RUT behaviour I would frequently look at the 'Skip' and 'Edit Route' options, to see where it was trying to get me to. Sometimes a phantom Via Point had been added to the list ie it was showing as the next point in the list, but I hadn't put it there, and it didn't show up on the map.

I have noticed a few times when setting off that after passing through my start point, it asks me if I want to skip it.

Yesterday I built a route on the XT and put in some key saved route points (ie favourites / saved). I was heading home via Congleton. I then used the Shape button to add a shaping point Before Congleton so that the route would take me on the correct road after the Wrexham By-Pass. A good way before either of these points, I had to leave the plotted route briefly, and it asked me if I wanted to Skip Congleton - the next Via Point. It didn't ask about the shaping point that was before Congleton.

In the situation that you describe my observation was that one of my early shaping points was not recognised, so it thought that I hadn't passed through it. I ignored that, because I was on the magenta line, and I assumed it would automatically continue to follow the magenta line. Which it did. Thereafter, every time I went through a route point, I checked the Skip list and non of the points that I passed through had been removed - it looked as though I was still supposed to be heading for that first missed point. I cannot remember if I was still getting spoken navigation. I wrote some notes about it. I'll dig them out.

Before I reached the end of the route I pressed Skip, and it went through each if the route points in turn from that very first one that tit thought that I hadn't visited.

My feeling was that when you rejoin the route after missing a shaping point (or it thinks you have missed a shaping point) although it continues to navigate ahead, the point is not automatically removed from the Skip List. Subsequently, none of the other points are removed.

I think that it may be necessary to skip any shaping points that you have missed even after rejoining the magenta line. That may have always been the case with the 590/595, and I never noticed.

Whether that theory is correct, I do not know. Ever since then, because of the phantom point and this behaviour, I have always constructed my routes using Waypoints - ie points created in basecamp with the flag tool, which are transferred to the XT as 'favourites' or 'saved'. I then set them to 'Vias' or 'Shaping'. The reason for doing this is that the XT then keeps the name that I have given to the point. Unless they are saved Waypoints, the XT will rename the point. So during testing my route points would be 01 ThisPoint, 02 ThatPoint, 03 SomeOtherPoint. Id sometimes include SP or VP in the name to remind me whether I had set it as a via or not.

I keep looking but I never again managed to capture that phantom via point even performing the identical test on the same route. And I haven't revisited the behaviour that you mentioned. It didn't seem to be related to the RUT behaviour - so I put it aside.

But yes, the XT still does weird stuff.

[Mzokk]

AH @ Plainmad.

Its not just me then. I was using this route to come back home from Connemara on Wednesday. Because of time constraints I decided to cut off the loop going to Clifden. (this was a route doctored to be saved using the java script) I stopped at Leenaun to delete the two waypoints on this loop and set off. It tried to then loop me back to a waypoint created near Cong Co Mayo. I stopped and started the route again using nearest entry point and the route behaved all the way back to Belfast. Still persisting with this thing even though I still have a Nav IV Zumo340, Zumo390 and Streetpilot 2610....but then I am a masochist

[jfheath]

Cong is the blue flag near to Clonbur / Gortjordan on the map ?

I can see the Blue flag and the green disc that you would have wanted to skip - and you did this around the location of the green dot next to the word 'Recess' on the map. It took me ages to find Leenaun on the map - that is because Garmin have spelled it Leenane !

Ok. I may be wrong - but It looks from the Basecamp route that The blue flag at Cong would be near to the start of the route ?
It also looks as though you didn't pass through it - or the XT didn't think that you had passed through it. In that case, it will always be wanting to take you back there.

If the XT isn't behaving as you think it should, it is worthwhile pressing the skip button, to see which point it is heading for next. If it is something that is behind you - agreeing to skip will clear that problem. Not passing throught he start point is a very common issue ever since the 590 and 595 and the related 39x and 34x were introduced. You MUST pass through the Via points. It is particularly common with shared group rides. Everyone with the same route congretgated arounfd the same start point. When some of the riders set off, they will have been in front to the start - and the satnav will spend the rest of the ride trying to get them to go back to it - even thought he screen shows the magenta line after the start plotting the route ahead.

It is for this reason that I always suggest placing the start point well away from the start. Eg if I am in the centre of a town or a city that had a ring road, my start point will be on the road that I want to take after I have escaped the ring of traffic surrounding the town. That way, if there are detours, road closures, trips for food, for petrol - whatever - the Zumo will keep recalculating a way to that first point - and pick up the route from there.

This has nothing to do witht he RUT behaviour or the alteration of the byte in the TRIP file. It is how the modern Zumos behave, and it is logical. Many people do not realise what is happening though.

[Mzokk]

Ill give it the benefit of the doubt as my Starting point was a little too close to Cross Co Mayo my starting point. If you want to see something even more weird name changes with zoom level on basecamp Lovely area mind

Lennaun.jpg (87.78 KiB) Viewed 1168 times

Leenane.jpg (51.64 KiB) Viewed 1168 times

IMG_20230607_105756650_HDR.jpg (738.27 KiB) Viewed 1168 times

IMG_20230607_111603897_HDR.jpg (779.32 KiB) Viewed 1168 times

[Peobody]

Leenaun, aka Leenane, I find it hard to believe that Garmin would have intentionally used zoom level to show both although I am routinely surprised at the things that appear and disappear as zoom level changes.

From Google Maps Quick facts: "Leenaun, also Leenane, is a village and 1,845 acre townland in County Galway, Ireland, on the southern shore of Killary Harbour and the northern edge of Connemara."

[mike_walker]

All - this has been fascinating and thanks for the script to sort out the routes. Hopefully Garmin will (one day) fix this issue so we don't have to mess around so much.

Those photos of Ireland make me want to plan a trip over the Irish Sea!!

One thing that I'd noticed, and just sharing for info, was that I used to export both my route and associated track as one .gpx file and then transfer to the XT using Garmin Drive. When I did that and then used the script on the file in the .trips folder, what I found was that the track was shown in the Tracks folder but the spanner wasn't available and so I couldn't show it on the screen. I've taken to exporting the two files separately so that I can show the track properly.

Anyhow else find this or was it just me?

[FrankB]

Anyhow else find this or was it just me?

Just tried it. Sent a GPX file with 5 routes and 5 tracks created from those route to the XT using Garmin Drive App. All tracks arrived and the spanner was available. I then connected the XT and used the script to set the trips to saved. Unplugged the XT, and the tracks were still there and the spanner worked. So 'cant reproduce' !